New XP scripts for non-combat actions.

Actually · Post by **Actually** » Tue May 06, 2003 6:31 pm

Hey all.

A person by the name of B. G. P. Hughes posted some interesting looking scripts on NWVault today to distribute XP to PC's and parties in an MP module for actions such as detecting/disarming traps, picking locks, etc. etc.

I only perused them briefly, but they seemed to do some interesting things to address the whole "why do I have to kill for xp?" question. Biggest issue I've seen so far is that, for the traps, they would all require unique tags, which would be a nightmare of code-overhaul and make it difficult for DM's to paint such traps on the fly from the pallette.

Still, worth checking out if anyone is interested.

Bye Now,
Jerry Cornelius - Code Monkey

Jordicus · Post by **Jordicus** » Tue May 06, 2003 6:49 pm

there was a discussion about the trap XP idea a while back in the Rogue Forum. The basic difficulty is how do you prevent exploiting? It would be a complex script in order to prevent someone from setting a trap, disable the trap, receive XP, set a trap, disable a trap, get XP, .....

Actually · Post by **Actually** » Tue May 06, 2003 6:54 pm

Hence the unique tag issue. Traps set by PC's either:

a) Would NOT have a unique tag, and therefore not trigger the script,

or,

b) WOULD have such a tag, and therefore would be very obvious in any PC tracking system that they were being used in such a fashion.

Ultimately, as I say, this is probably too complex to be worth retro-fitting the whole PW's code. But it's nice scripting.

Bye Now,
Jerry Cornelius - White Trash Dessert.

Aradan Kir · Post by **Aradan Kir** » Tue May 06, 2003 8:27 pm

and what about characters that aren't rogues?

how would a paladin be awarded XP, or a cleric? For healing people? Then they would also have to have some sort of exploit prevention.

I guess fighters (and possibly Paladins) would get their character XP through slaying, but clerics / druids / mages are difficult ones I think.

izyk · Post by **izyk** » Tue May 06, 2003 8:38 pm

As a monk I want to be rewarded with XP every time someone walks away from a conversation with my character confused and morally distraught over an issue they previously thought was clearcut.

e.g. killing gang members in the slums. Hunting ogres in the hills of tumult, men wearing dresses. That sort of thing.

Try scripting that. :->

It underscores the problem effectively. Theoretically the xp gain from detecting , disarming, and avoiding a trap is that you get to live.

Actually · Post by **Actually** » Tue May 06, 2003 8:41 pm

The scripts in question are mostly for locks and traps, although there is an "advancing the plot" script I didn't look at closer.

To be honest, I WOULDN'T give ANY class an xp boost for anything that didn't require a die roll. Just a hold over from my DM days. If you can cast/perform/layhands/whatever as an innate character skill w/ no chance of failure, then in my mind that's a class feature and is it's own reward. XP should, IMO, be a reward w/ associated risks. You might fail the die roll, and if ya do ya get squat. But if make the die roll, then yer skills develop overall.

Which is why I wouldn't apply an xp gain to healing, rez'ing, detecting traps you set yourself, or any other such thing. No risk = no gain.

Back in the day, they used to scale the xp for rogues higher than other classes, 'cause at the time xp was also given (on a percentage basis) for all treasure "acquired". The higher xp requirements per rogue level addressed the VERY real neccessity that rogues represent in most fantasy settings. It's possible to play w/o traps, locks, sneaking into/out-of anywhere, but few games or scenarios take that approach, 'cause most people take it for granted that such things will be there, and will need a rogue to handle.

Bye Now,
Jerry Cornelius - I don't even play rogues.

Aloro · Post by **Aloro** » Tue May 06, 2003 8:51 pm

I can think of a few ways to prevent exploiting with trap-removal scripting. The simplest involve local variables that track whether the trap has been disarmed. You could either store a local variable on the trap itself (meaning each trap could be disarmed once for exp), or store it on the player (meaning each player could disarm each trap once for exp).

I'd love to see this, but I confess I'm also not very excited by it. Why the contradiction? Because, though I would be very very happy to see more ways for people to earn exp outside of combat, disarming traps IS ALREADY REWARDING.

My preference would be to find ways to script rewards for other things PCs do - such as healing commoners.

- Aloro

jadeia · Post by **jadeia** » Wed May 07, 2003 2:33 am

Anything that gives xp is ALREADY exploited.

Lures, spawns, camping at the Village crypts, newbies grouping with tanks and going into heavy combat, etc etc etc.

Ive always lobby'd for xp on these instances:

1) You enter a NEW AREA for the first time.
2) You speak to a NEW NPC for the first time.
3) XP for so many lines of spoken text, accumalted (ie 100 lines = 10 xp or whatever)'
4) Disarming an existing module set trap
5) Opening an existing module set lock
6) Pickpocketing an NPC

But of course, these things would be exploited, wouldnt they, by a small minded, immature, and very small minorty on Avlis.

So, because of this, no-one gets it.

Thats why we are trying to weed out the dupers, exploiters and general spoilers out of avlis.

Jordicus · Post by **Jordicus** » Wed May 07, 2003 2:51 am

besides.... XP cookies earned from a DM are much more satisfying. That way you know you have done something that was attention worthy, instead of blindly earning random XP by doing minor tasks which may or may not provide XP...

jadeia · Post by **jadeia** » Wed May 07, 2003 3:00 am

Jordicus wrote:besides.... XP cookies earned from a DM are much more satisfying. That way you know you have done something that was attention worthy, instead of blindly earning random XP by doing minor tasks which may or may not provide XP...

Yes that is so true. To be honest, I make it a rule to find at least a handfull of people, each session I am on, to give XP cookies to. I mean, I dont give them out because I have to, but rather, actively look for newbies who are rp'ing well.

Just that, when I play my alt character, there is no one *sniff sniff* to give me xp. Once I even was confused when I couldnt find the XP menu on the radial dial, after about a 1 hour in character discussion between my pc and another. Forgot I wasnt on as DM.. LOL..