Shadows and Skyboxes

[Nighthawk4]

Whilst playing around with a test module of mine, I just noticed that the angle of the shadows does not match with the direction of the Sun in the Skybox. This is true for the Desert and the Rural areas. Those are the only types of area I have in this module, except for caves, which don't have a Skybox (nor much Sunlight of course).

Can this angle be adjusted, so it looks as if the Sun is casting the shadows please?

[Fuzz]

There's a way to adjust the lightsource angle, I just can't remember it at the moment. For an exterior area, you want to use an area light, which is somewhere in the Area Properties window... should be a tutorial somewhere on the Bioware website.

[Dirk Cutlass]

*Sulks because Dirk has to run his PC on lowest graphics settings because of crappy old processor, hasn't seen a shadow or a "sky-box" in months *


EDIT: But at least I have broadband NH4

[Nighthawk4]

*Sulks because Dirk has to run his PC on lowest graphics settings because of crappy old processor, hasn't seen a shadow or a "sky-box" in months *


EDIT: But at least I have broadband NH4

*Makes note to look out for Dirk next time he is online as a DM*

[Kitten]

Sky boxes are bad.

Much lag, ne?

[Dirk Cutlass]

Sky boxes are bad.

Much lag, ne?

Only at your end, and only if you haven't got a fast enough graphics system, and technically it's called low frame rate. It has no impact on the server lag.

[Themicles]

Sky boxes are bad.

Much lag, ne?

Lag = In the common internet usage: Latency. An increased amount of time that it takes data to travel between your computer and the server. A slow down of the internet traffic involved.

Frame Rate = Frames drawn per second. NTSC TV signals have a framerate of around 30 fps. Most people notice when frame rates are lower than 30. Some people can tell if they're not at least at a higher level, such as 60 fps.

Now, you can technically say that your video card is lagging behind on drawing frames. But when someone complains of "lag" it usually is accepted that they are complaining about connection quality.

Skyboxes do not cause lag. Skyboxes can potentially cause a drop in framerate, if your system is lower than even the minimum requirements of games released in the last few months.

There is a difference between lag and framerate.

An area having skyboxes enabled, when you, the client, has them disabled, will have NO EFFECT on your performance.

On the same note of this quote, others have also complained that spell VFX cause lag. They do not. They may hurt the framerate on your system, but you can control that in the graphics options.

As for Fuzz's response:
You cannot adjust the angle the light is coming from in the toolset.

As for the initial post: Yeah, I know, it drives me nuts. Kick BioWare.



-Themicles

[Serineth Swiftpaw]

*gives Therm a round of applause*

[Kitten]

Quick note: I never actually said skyboxes made the server lag. A low frame rate is client side lag, being that lag literally means:

lag1 ( P ) Pronunciation Key (lg)
v. lagged, lag?ging, lags
v. intr.
To fail to keep up a pace; straggle.
To proceed or develop with comparative slowness: The electric current lags behind the voltage.
To fail, weaken, or slacken gradually; flag.
Games. To determine the order of play in billiards by successively hitting the cue ball against the end rail, the ball rebounding closest to the head rail indicating the player to shoot first.

v. tr.
To cause to hang back or fall behind.
To shoot, throw, or pitch (a coin, for example) at a mark.

n.
The act, process, or condition of lagging.
One that lags.
A condition of slowness or retardation.

The extent or duration of lagging: ?He wondered darkly at how great a lag there was between his thinking and his actions? (Thomas Wolfe).
An interval between events or phenomena considered together.

Lag is the cumulative term given to absolutely all elements of slowness when concerning game play. Lag does not = latency. Latency = latency (surprisingly).

You're right in saying it doesn't affect latency, but your definition of lag is inaccurate to its meaning as described in the dictionary.

*sticks tongue out*

[Kinarr]

Hmm, okay, I got curious and had to look into the details.

The sky box model has fewer faces than a tree model so there shouldn't be any noticeable framerate difference. The textures are kind of big though (3 mb) so if you don't have much video memory that could be an issue.

All the sky boxes are oriented so that the apparent light source is coming from the east. So the moon, sunrise, daytime, and sunset are all from the east.

The sun model is always at the northeast corner of the area, so that's why the shadows don't line up with the apparent light source on the sky box texture.

I did a little test and moved the sun model.
http://kinarr.home.comcast.net/misc/gidy_sun.mdl
Put that file in your nwn/override folder and it will cause shadows to appear straight from the east in a 16 x 16 area, but in areas that are much bigger or smaller than that, the shadows will be off angle again.

I suppose, if one were crazy enough, you could turn off lighting in outdoor areas and make the sun into a placeable. Then you could move the sun every hour so that it tracks from east to west across the area.
If one were crazy enough to do that.

[Nighthawk4]

Hey thanks Kinarr - it works. Now it looks as if the Sun is casting the shadows. Very nice.

Also thanks to Themicles for that information - fancy Bioware getting that wrong.

The Sun setting in the East is bad enough, but for the light source not to be in the correct direction to produce the shadows is crazy.

[Themicles]

Actually, Kitten, lag has more definitions in the dictionaries than what you posted alone.

You also missed the entire point of my comparison.

Lag, as used by internet user, is, and has always been, most commonly used to describe bad latency between a client and a server. Lag, even per your posted definition does fit as a descriptor in place of *bad* latency.

Lag, as per commonly accepted internet slang, is used when referring to connection issues.

Frame rate, poor performance, etc, are much more preferrable when referring to the client side of things.


Why do I bother explaining?
Because other users, who don't know any better, could read your post and assume that having skyboxes on Avlis is a cause of the tremendous lag that Avlis users frequently experience. And worst case, it snowballs into a bunch of people who don't know any better running at the Avlis team with pitchforks, crying out for all skyboxes in Avlis to be disabled.

Get it? Good.

-Themicles

[Kitten]

BURN THE SKY BOXES! *runs around with a pitchfork*

lag2 ( P ) Pronunciation Key (lg)
n.
A barrel stave.
A strip, as of wood, that forms a part of the covering for a cylindrical object.

tr.v. lagged, lag?ging, lags
To furnish or cover with lags.