Issac spells and a few others

Spell Singer · Post by **Spell Singer** » Mon Sep 29, 2003 10:21 am

I have been trying to figure out where the lesser and greater Issac's missile storm come from but I can not find these spells in the 3.5 players handbook, the magic of farun, the forgotten realms source book or in any suplement the local game store had on their shelf. Does anyone know where they came from?

Also has anyone tried using Blindness/Defeness on a NPC or creature and observed it having an effect? My single player bard/wizard had that for a while but every time I tried to use it there seemed to be no affect on the NPC for being blind.

Realy stupid thing about blindness is that you can read the scroll "cure blindness" while blind and cure yourself.

Also they changed Sleep so it is now useful (my low level bard struggling through SOU is finding it very useful...very useful).

Neve · Post by **Neve** » Mon Sep 29, 2003 10:25 am

Floodgate made those two spells up

Glocknal · Post by **Glocknal** » Mon Sep 29, 2003 10:46 am

Actually I think the Issac's Missle spells came from 2nd Edition Forgotten Realms. I cant exactly remember where but I think it was called Issac's lesser and Gr. Force missle. Dont quote me on that..

Glok

Soulbinder · Post by **Soulbinder** » Thu Oct 23, 2003 11:38 am

i am not sure too ... but i think the forcemissile thing was called:

Mordecains lesser / greater Forcemissiles, and when i remember right, the very special thing at this spell was that is pierces SPELL RESISTANCE as a direct damage spell. But i think it did much less damage than isaacs missilestrom ... but as i said i am not completly sure

WrathOG777 · Post by **WrathOG777** » Thu Oct 23, 2003 2:34 pm

Compared to other spells 4th lvl the lesser storm as originaly made is exactly what you would get if you researched a 4th lvl magic missle. Only, in PnP, you should be able to choose the target of each missle instead of it being spread amoung targets randomly, which the closest NWN could simulate is enemy only.

The greater, that is friggin all kinds of overboard. Seems it would be balanced with other 6th lvl spells if it was 4d8 at 1/4lvl. That would make it just a wee bit more damage then flame arrow (3->4), No save (4->5), and non-elemental (5->6). So at 11 (when a wizard researches this spell), chain lightning is 11d6 and 5d6 per extra. Missle storm is 8d8 to one, or 4d8 to two. Lightning is more damage, missles have a higher chance of landing.

The interesting this about PnP is that all spells exist. The ones in the book are only suggestions. A player can research all their own spells. The key is balanceing them with the spell lvl, not finding the spell in some book.

Blah blah, pretty sure this is irrelvant.

keikobad · Post by **keikobad** » Thu Oct 23, 2003 2:52 pm

Speaking of made-up spells, I couldn't find any PnP equivalents for Shadow Shield (protects a mage from neg. energy and death spells, including a water ele's drown I think?).

Are there any or is that another thing that makes sense in a single-player RPG, but not in a multi-player with clerics?

WrathOG777 · Post by **WrathOG777** » Thu Oct 23, 2003 3:11 pm

I think Shadow Shield is appropriately powerful for its lvl. Spells existing is not the issue. Many many more should. The choices should be next to limitless.

For instance. There is no IC reason that the knowing the sheild spell mages get at lvl 1, that a wizard could not research a varient that gives every single kind of ac bonus. That would be +4 natural, dodge, deflection, luck, base armor, armor enchantment, base shield, competance, and shield enchantement. Giveing that wizard a 46 ac using 9 lvl 1 slots. Completely within the rules of the game PnP. Would have to use lvl 2 slots to get these all memorized, but it could happen.

Titanium Dragon · Post by **Titanium Dragon** » Thu Oct 23, 2003 5:22 pm

Untrue Wrath. That would be comletely unbalanced. The very best kind of AC bonus is a dodge bonus - a level 9 spell, foresight, gives a +2 dodge bonus. Barkskin gives a natural AC bonus and is very different from shield. Shield gives the worst type of AC bonus, the most common type - that is why it gives a +4 bonus to AC, because it basically does not stack with many items a wizard might use.

Additionally, giving that many AC boosting spells to a wizard would be just wrong. I can't think of any DM stupid enough to allow that.

Bulleted list:

Dodge - given by almost nothing. NWN added a lot of these, but in PnP it is very rare.
Luck - Luck bonuses are pretty rare, and thus good - they stack with most anything because they are rare
Competetence - a competence bonus to AC? There aren't many of those. Again, very powerful.
Natural - Look at barkskin, a spell two levels higher, and you will see why this would be unbalanced
Shield - This is an enhancement to a shield. Unless you are using a shield, a bonus of this type makes no sense
Base armor - Nothing modifies this to my knowledge magically, thus would be rediculous. It represents physical armor
Base shield - Same as above
Deflection - This might be legit, but with sheild already doing basically the same thing, allowing both would be unfairly powerful

WrathOG777 · Post by **WrathOG777** » Thu Oct 23, 2003 5:44 pm

in the player handbook, across several spell lvls, there does exist base armor, shield and armor enchantment, dodge, and natural, just off the top of my head.

The spells are...
Sheild, mage armor, magic vestment, barkskin, and haste. These have varied values, durations, and extra effects and as you mentioned some are considered more powerful thus get a higher spell level. Getting competance and luck bonus would not be that much of a stretch.

My point not being that they would be low lvl, but available should the player wish to research them. Thus, my basis for saying that useing the lack of a spell in the official spell lists published in the PnP versions of the game as a flawed reason to say a spell should not exist on Avlis. Many more spells should exist if they are made balanced compared to the power of that spell lvl. What a wizard could do with intellegent use of spell combinations is NOT a consideration in the power lvl of a spell. That is the one and only advantage of being a wizard, having a big spell list that enables one to be creative with spell combinations to fit each occasion.

Dirk Cutlass · Post by **Dirk Cutlass** » Thu Oct 23, 2003 5:55 pm

I only remember AD&D. They had an extra book set that came out later which was called Unearthed Acana IIRC.

In Unearthed Arcana was some nice illusionist spells (in the days when illusionists were a different class to normal magic users - what you folks call wizards these days).

One nice illusionist spell was "Phantasmal Armour", which bascially cast the illusion that you were wearing plate-mail. I can't remeber the details, but I think if the attacker didn't spot the illusion, then you basically got a base armor class like plate armor ... which was nice for a 1st level mage

The details are probably all wrong ... hell it was a long time ago!