History of the tarot

Xiaou · Post by **Xiaou** » Thu Jun 17, 2004 9:59 pm

I read the campaign notes yesterday and collided them with the RL history of tarot and came up with this. Wondering what you think or would change. I was also going to try to make up an avlis themed tarot deck, some supplementary occult magiks definitions (numerology, astrology maybe if we have a constellation chart around somewhere) and an avlissian themed layout for the cards to be read. I'd put alot of wiggle room into it, no one likes being tied down to one method for this kind of stuff anyway.

History of Tarot

The reading of tarot has been a tradition of romini culture since the time of formation of the fold of nine. In these days the differences between the fruits of the vortex of mortal magic in the form of divination magic and communion with nature spirits were being decided. Tarot, like other forms of traditional Romini, Tyeduan and Khanjr Kuro magiks were named by the fold as not of their own domain.

From even the earliest times traditional divination magiks of this sort have been practised solely by women. The reason for this is rather straightforward. No man has ever had success using occult divination magiks. While there are tales of romini men who've had some success in creating protective charms, love potions and bestowing curses as time wore on the details and evidence of these practitioners faded from our ability to verify. Effectively, Romini men have left magiks as belonging to the mantle of women.

To a point should even these magiks be available to men, it is unsuprising that their use should fall to the wayside. Few stories of charms or curses actually doing what they should exist. Furthermore, love potions disagree with the revered message of Mikon's freedom of choice and is subsequently a practice frowned upon.

The tarot was at the very first a game. Played very similar to bridge and especially by sailors who would teach it to traders and port residents wherever they went. In a short period of time people began adding cards they felt were missing from the deck. The deck always conjured a homespun imagery to the players and to this end room was made in the rules of the game to allow for more cards here, less cards there as the composition of player homelands dictated.

To prevent fights over lost gold it is thought that a boat captain from Mikona encouraged his men to find a badge to signify the winner of a game so that prestige would be his. This tradition spread and the only remaining badge we know of is the jade ring. A captain of a boat home-ported in Andarr was doing a brisk trade to Khanjar Kuro but fell victim to an attack at sea. Limping into a foreign port, cargo intact but taking on water and very light of crew they were stranded for weeks until the ship could be repaired.

During this time the captain took on many local sailors to crew his vessel and bring it home. Somewhere during the repairs or the journey home the decision to use the jade ring as the badge became a subject of much scrutiny by the crew, by the time they reached Andarr even the Andarran sailors were convinced that there was a connection to the cards and spirits.

This concept was like a fire to dry brush when it reached the ears of Tyeduans and Romini and has been a principle method of opening the mind to the whispers of the spirits ever since. The use of the jade ring as a badge has been forgotton by most practitioners. Availability of the mineral doomed it being able to secure a firm place as a required article of the person doing the reading. It is however regarded everywhere as a luck and skill giving item, something an owner of one would prize.

Aloro · Post by **Aloro** » Thu Jun 17, 2004 10:09 pm

Erm. Great job... but... why the random sexism?

From even the earliest times traditional divination magiks of this sort have been practised solely by women. The reason for this is rather straightforward. No man has ever had success using occult divination magiks.

I have no idea where this comes from. On Earth, divinations have historically been performed at least as often by men as by women.

- Aloro

Xiaou · Post by **Xiaou** » Thu Jun 17, 2004 11:24 pm

But I think among gypsies from the stuff I wrote earlier about the romini it implied or outright stated that women were the only ones who did the card reading. Look that over and you'll see lots of all the usual suspects about uncleanliness directed at women. Its all the same old song and dance. Uncleanliness associated with menses, yadda yadda.

We seem to be okay with loosely conceding that there is enough cultural stuff going on with the romini to have Marhime going on. Eh, just giving them a benefit to go with the stigma.

nonscience · Post by **nonscience** » Mon Jun 21, 2004 3:14 pm

Just to point,

You say Tarot was at first a game. It is still a game. All around here we play it on a daily basis.

Another add to your historical search, Tarot is derived from an egyptian card deck who, as you said with the sailors, travelled all around Mediteranean coast.

Aloro · Post by **Aloro** » Mon Jun 21, 2004 3:26 pm

nonscience wrote:Another add to your historical search, Tarot is derived from an egyptian card deck who, as you said with the sailors, travelled all around Mediteranean coast.

Actually, that origin is probably apocryphal. The first records of any tarot deck are from 14th century Italy - there are no records of any such thing in Egypt. The Thoth derivation story, though dear to my own heart, is unsubstantiated.

- Aloro

nonscience · Post by **nonscience** » Mon Jun 21, 2004 3:53 pm

I didn't say it was the original one.

It's a deviation from this egyptian game. But you're right for italian period. It spred in europe south from there.
And it is always popular here in france as a game.

Xiaou · Post by **Xiaou** » Mon Jun 21, 2004 6:46 pm

Its funny how many things associated with gypsies is labelled as egyptian in origin. I'm no expert by all means but it seemed to me that by the time Tarot was used as a form of divination in the real world (17th-18th century) the word gypsy and egyptian were synonymous. I'm not arguing against your statement though. Just pointing out that when France, for example, joined the list of nations who would expel or kill anyone they found to be gypsy on their land they referred to them as Egyptian.

This is why alot of things associated with gypsies sometimes get labelled as being from Egypt. That does not men you are wrong though. Thanks for the tip about it still being a game. I had no idea.

nonscience · Post by **nonscience** » Mon Jun 21, 2004 7:06 pm

About the "modern" tarot game, it's not really played like bridge.

It's game ranging from three to five players. The basics aren't so hard, but you'll be amazed how real players can tell which cards you're handling and which one you're gonna play. This is where "modern" tarot game joins with the fortune tellers

I looked at some french sites. All are according to say that the origins aren't certain. But the meaning of the word tarot is explained as follows.
TAR-> means WAY
RO-> means ROYAL
Both are derived from egyptian, as Ro stands for another word for Ra, the sun god.

If you ever feel the urge to learn the rules, i can help you.

Aloro · Post by **Aloro** » Mon Jun 21, 2004 8:32 pm

nonscience wrote:TAR-> means WAY
RO-> means ROYAL
Both are derived from egyptian, as Ro stands for another word for Ra, the sun god.

Err... sorry, not trying to be rude, but that folk etymology is an old one, and is not at all accurate.

First, those words aren't from Middle (what we call Ancient) Egyptian - they have the wrong phonetic characteristics. Second, that's not how you would construct an adjective-noun clause in Middle Egyptian. I base both of the above on my own studies taking the graduate-level classes in Middle Egyptian at UCLA (it was a year's worth of classes on Middle Egyptian, taught by Dr. Antonio Loprieno, who is both a great guy and a world authority on Ancient Egypt - I took every class he offered). Third, Ra wasn't the king of the Gods, and his name doesn't mean "Royal". Usir (Osiris) was the King or Pharoah of the Kemetic (Egyptian) gods.

The first (verified) recorded name for the Tarot was "carte da trionfi". The Italians changed this to "tarocchi", which the French then changed to "tarot". There is no etymological link with any Egyptian language there.

Again, no offense intended.

- Aloro

Bear · Post by **Bear** » Mon Jun 21, 2004 9:31 pm

Aloro wrote:
nonscience wrote:TAR-> means WAY
RO-> means ROYAL
Both are derived from egyptian, as Ro stands for another word for Ra, the sun god.
Err... sorry, not trying to be rude, but that folk etymology is an old one, and is not at all accurate.

First, those words aren't from Middle (what we call Ancient) Egyptian - they have the wrong phonetic characteristics. Second, that's not how you would construct an adjective-noun clause in Middle Egyptian. I base both of the above on my own studies taking the graduate-level classes in Middle Egyptian at UCLA (it was a year's worth of classes on Middle Egyptian, taught by Dr. Antonio Loprieno, who is both a great guy and a world authority on Ancient Egypt - I took every class he offered). Third, Ra wasn't the king of the Gods, and his name doesn't mean "Royal". Usir (Osiris) was the King or Pharoah of the Kemetic (Egyptian) gods.

The first (verified) recorded name for the Tarot was "carte da trionfi". The Italians changed this to "tarocchi", which the French then changed to "tarot". There is no etymological link with any Egyptian language there.

Again, no offense intended.

- Aloro

Well... ladi dah. I once took a class called "rocks for jocks" at Berkeley. That makes me more smarter than you Aloro.

Bear

nonscience · Post by **nonscience** » Mon Jun 21, 2004 9:48 pm

I willingly admit that i can be wrong. After all i only collected this analyze of the word using the infernal worth g**gle.

[/quote]Again, no offense intended.

- Aloro[/quote]

Never mind with me, i rarely take offense. I like to better myself, and what better than learning and discussing with people all around the world.

Meanwhile, if anyone is up to learn modern tarot game...I'm here.

Aloro · Post by **Aloro** » Mon Jun 21, 2004 9:48 pm

Bear wrote:Well... ladi dah. I once took a class called "rocks for jocks" at Berkeley. That makes me more smarter than you Aloro.

Bear

I think you meant "more smarterer".

And hey, I know how much money you make, man, and I'm not arguing with you. You are indeed much more smarterer.

Now answer your damned phone!

- Aloro