The World of Avlis

So I have had the expertise feat for a while and I dont think ive ever really used it, despite knowing what it does, because the idea of forfeigting damage never sounded like a good idea to me. But just today when I was being chased by 12 dwarven mercs I thought "hey, maybe instead of using 10 kits this time, I should try expertise!" and I did.

To my delight, I was creaming the dwarves even while surrounded by them, and some waiting in line. As well, I only had to use two kits. I am a fan now.

But I wanted to know, do any other fighter types or anyone ever use this feat? Post your answer and any details. Id love to know how and when and why you use it.

I love it, whether I'm out killing things by myself or with a group ( assuming the group knows enough to form a line with tanks in front instead of just running all over the place).
Expertise is one of the best things a fighter can do to help his group. You hold the bad guys back and take the hits while everybody else does damage.

Haven't taken imp expertise yet but am considering it, maybe post epic

I don't use it, not because I don't like it, but because my char will never qualify for it, on the other hand, I do have divine shield to use instead, and I use that quite a bit

I use improved expertise quite liberally. It doesn't take 10 off the damage, but off the to hit. However, that extra 10 to your AC is a godsend, especially in a low magic item world.

In a group or solo, I think it is a must have for any fighter / frontliner.

My $.02.

I have three characters in Avlis with very different builds but all three are melee oriented. One of them has Expertise, the other two have Improved Expertise.

Unless I've been greatly confused, it gives a penalty to attack rolls, not to damage.

Anyway, both my fighter and my pale master-steelcaster have it and use it as needed.

Ah to hit. right. my mistake.

My ranger has it, and uses it all the time. At 4th level, it's a huge advantage. A 4th level character with an AC of 25 is something to see

loki70 wrote:My ranger has it, and uses it all the time. At 4th level, it's a huge advantage. A 4th level character with an AC of 25 is something to see

I didnt even think of it at a low level... wow... I think ill get that for my alt... ooooohhhh....

Almost ever melee build I make picks it up if they have the required intelligence for it. Extra AC is always a huge boon

what are the pre-reqs for it?

An intelligence score of 13 or higher.

Wyrmwing wrote:An intelligence score of 13 or higher.

*counts out remaining feats*

A effective AC of 50 sure does sound tempting

As soon as I get the extra INT point (lots of levels away ) I'm going for it.

Does it stack with things like Barkskin ?

Expertise and Imp. Expertise stacks with everything, it's gives you +5/+10 to touch AC too, iirc.

Actually, if I'm going to use anything I use Improved Expertise these days - don't bother with normal (+5) Expertise . The extra +10 is great, (total AC about 45 or so when Improved Expertise is turned on, that's plate and all the other goodies +4 but no shield), and I still get whacked by high-level spawns!

If I want a quick kill (them, not me ) then I don't use it. But if the battle looks tough. To be honest, against most foes Leo's AB is so high that he will hit most things even with Improved Expertise, the biggest difference is that I don't get so many critical hits, so I often use it when up against crit immune things (undead, constructs, etc.).

If in doubt, always start with (Improved)Expertise on, if you feel comfotable then maybe try and take it off and see how the battle fairs. Its a trade off between killing the enemy quickly and getting hit yourself. Sometimes it is a better strategy to kill quickly (you may take less damage in the long run).

Combined with some DR and concealment (e.g. Improved Invis) it can make you a pretty tough little cookie.

EDIT: Leo took the feat at early level .. .maybe even 1st level I think ! Don't forget that at very low level you do not get the full +5.. I think it only gives you up to your AB, so if your AB is +2 you only get +2 AC (i.e. it won't let your AB go negative.. basically you're trading off AB vs AC).

Shaktar and Slits both have expertise, I think Laen does.

Kered has power attack instead, because when I first made him he was meant to eventually become a Blackguard, in the days before I realised on ly Malekites would be able to do that. Power attack was part of the route to Divine Might and Divine Shield, or whatever those feats are called.

I used to love Expertise and Improved Expertise when I played here. My character was a druid/shifter, and so she never hit things anywhere near her level in melee anyway. However, couple Epic Gargoyle form with Improved Expertise and a few Arcane Archer friends, and you have a character that can hang in melee forever sustaining minimal damage while his/her friends completely tear up the baddies. It's a great feat for group monster smashin', particularly if your character isn't going to kill anything anyway (mine never did!).

I just took the feat yesterday so I will wait to see how I like it.

My main concern is how easy will it be to use? does it turn off during combat at inopportune times?

Does anything besides casting negate it?

Speaking of touch AC, how is that calculated again?

Thanks

If I redid my character from the begining i would take this feat in the stead of others. *sighs* Now that Friday is epic she has pretty strict progression if she hopes to take epic dodge.

pedsdmd wrote:Speaking of touch AC, how is that calculated again?

There are about 47 threads about that particular topic.

A search using "touch" and "AC" as keywords would provide you with a number of them. For instance, this one:

viewtopic.php?t=59112&highlight=touch+ac

pedsdmd wrote:I just took the feat yesterday so I will wait to see how I like it.

My main concern is how easy will it be to use? does it turn off during combat at inopportune times?

Does anything besides casting negate it?

Nothing can negate it, but it is an active combat feat and will go off when combat is over and you go flat-footed (much like Power Attack or Rapid Shot or other stuff like that). Basically if you move without moving to attack then it will cancel the mode. Just be careful and make sure you always click on a target if you have to run across the battle field. Also can be frustrating in laggy situations, e.g. you click on it and nothing happens and you click on it again and you see "Expertise Mode Enabled" "Expertise Mode Disabled" scroll up the screen. Just be careful and be patient with it is my advice.

Expertise is one of the best feats in the game. I find no matter what level you are, it will come in handy during certain encounters, whether in a group of soloing. Zach has an extremely high AC, but even he has times when going purely defensive saves his rear.

I have Sable as a pure Cleric with a militant flare ( Ra-Ghul follower). She is pretty low level and she has it, too. I don't use it too often, mostly when I tink I'm about to get my butt kicked.

Nope. Won't use it. I use Power Attack, and the combined -15 to attack would be stupid.