The World of Avlis

Okay, first and foremost, I am well aware there are forums at nwn.bioware.com, but they suck ass. They suck lots and lots of ass, so I don't use them if I can avoid it. I have, however, searched them for information pertaining to this topic and some of the other topics I'm about to ask questions about in this thread and others. Their search engine though doesn't return positive results on posts that I KNOW are there, cause I've gone and looked at one, then done a search that with any engine in the known world would return a positive for that post, and not gotten one. So, screw Bioware.

Wow, that should have been a rant... but I wanted to cut down on folks pointing me there if at all possible On to the real question:

I have noticed that though the automapper works in Avlis that after a certain period of time, or a server restart, or something, any data that the automapper had for my particular character is lost. Now, I'm guessing this means automapper data is stored on the server, and is non-persistent. This makes sense to me because if I went and took my level 20 character and ran him all over the place I could then find a way to extract those maps from the character file or wherever they get stuck and pass them out to other people. This is not happy.

What bothers me though is the lack of ability to use a pretty well designed system in the game. The ability to add information to and otherwise customize user-placeable pins is a great thing, yet we can't make use of it... Is there a solution to this that avoids pen and paper, or is it just the way it is?

My next question is only somewhat related. Given that there are various room sizes and that exits to a room can appear at any given point, even in the center of it in terms of city scapes and the like, how exactly are you all doing your mapping on paper? Graphing them properly without something to scale by is simply beyond my artistic ability, i think. Is that the only way or has someone come up with a genious solution? Is there a way other than screenshots, to transpose information from the automapper window to a printable source or something?

*taps temple twice*
Give yourself a month or two, you'd be suprised.

Wait a month or two to start mapping? It's in the newbie guide, silly

He meant you will have it all in your head

And once its in your head, it doesn't go away.

Its been months since I last actively played, due to my work on Travellers.
I was on just the other day, and still remember my way around the forests
of T'Nanshi.

-Themicles

Bah.

Had a friend over the other night and I told him I could get from the city gates to Timo's house with my eyes closed. He didn't believe me.

The part that scared me was I did. I didn't click on the door, but I was right in front of it.

Themicles wrote:And once its in your head, it doesn't go away.

Its been months since I last actively played, due to my work on Travellers.
I was on just the other day, and still remember my way around the forests
of T'Nanshi.

-Themicles

That is all very well for you young people.

We elderly players do not have such good ........ er, what were we talking about please?

There are also folks that think the map needs to be completely disabled. A feature the area builders do not have the option for, yet. When they do however, in some areas I am sure, the mapping feature will not function.

WrathOG777 wrote:There are also folks that think the map needs to be completely disabled. A feature the area builders do not have the option for, yet. When they do however, in some areas I am sure, the mapping feature will not function.

This is untrue you CAN disable maps in certain areas, it's quite simple actually. Unless soemthig changed in SoU of course. Do a search for it on NWVault or the forums. Anyone who went to mythos and did any decent amount of exploring found at least one dungeon where the automapper was blacked out.



~S

yepp, makes the map all black. Very good. The map is probably one of the mosted used ooc in formation, after the floating name. When in party, you see where the other members are.

Close the map, and disable the mouse over funtion in the game option menu and play around for some hours if you havent. It is a good experince. I beg all to at least disable the mouse floting text "thing"

WR

Not when too many identical lokong folks are around... after al, leather armor +1 is leather armor +1..

unfortunately, as avatars are simply too similar in many cases, PC and NPC alike, you need the mouseover in order to find certain persons ot know whom of your aquintainces you speak with. Not everybody has a distinctive avatar.

If you wears a helm and an armor that are similar to someone else, there is very hard to identify a friend from another unless he/she talks asit should be. RL Sweden got a law or a demand for a law to have number on the helms for policemans when they work in groups to be able to investigate problems with riots, or other thing have happended that need to be investigated to sue a policeman.

I have this funcition in game option not activated since months back, and it is still possible use examine, or press "TAB". Tab activate the mouse over that can be good to see if it is an oak tree or mahogny for example. When you talk, you see the avatar and the name in the dialog window. If you "know" this person, you can be sure you recognice the voice from this, else the name is ooc info. Just my thoughts

Vicky wrote:[shameless promoting of own work]

Underdark, The Great Nothing?

NOT ANY MORE.... MWHAHAHAHAHAH!

[/shameless promoting of own work]

Please report any broken transitions under the Wilderness and Underdark bug section. I'm loathe to give you all a map because it may ruin it, but I know some players are working on one. You'll just have to count while you explore!

Oh, and if you're not scared the first time you go down there I want to know why! Even I was when I tested it and I knew what was round the corner - mind you, I am a trainee lesbian pixie so fear is actually my middle name.

Vicky

This post gave me the impression that the underdark has the minimap and that vicky wished she could of disabled it. Perhaps she is talking about a real map type bigger scale that shows multiple zone.

WrathOG777 wrote:

Vicky wrote:[shameless promoting of own work]

Underdark, The Great Nothing?

NOT ANY MORE.... MWHAHAHAHAHAH!

[/shameless promoting of own work]

Please report any broken transitions under the Wilderness and Underdark bug section. I'm loathe to give you all a map because it may ruin it, but I know some players are working on one. You'll just have to count while you explore!

Oh, and if you're not scared the first time you go down there I want to know why! Even I was when I tested it and I knew what was round the corner - mind you, I am a trainee lesbian pixie so fear is actually my middle name.

Vicky

This post gave me the impression that the underdark has the minimap and that vicky wished she could of disabled it. Perhaps she is talking about a real map type bigger scale that shows multiple zone.

She probably does wish she coudl have disabled it, but if the map was disable din the underdark noone would ever go, because they would never come back. People get lost as it is down there. Personally i'd LOVE to have it disabled, it'd make the UD much fun!


~S

@Strangg

disabling the minimap, requires a hak for each tileset that basically replces the standard minimap graphics for that tileset with a black graphic.

there is no way currently other than that to disable minimaps. Trust me on this, I spent hours researching it...

I too spent hours... and came up with the same answer. And yes, I really would have loved to have disabled it. I love the idea of people being lost down there... forever!

V x x x

But umm... why?

That wouldn't be fun. I am CERTAIN it would be PW-leaving not-fun for many, too.

Jordicus wrote:@Strangg

disabling the minimap, requires a hak for each tileset that basically replces the standard minimap graphics for that tileset with a black graphic.

there is no way currently other than that to disable minimaps. Trust me on this, I spent hours researching it...

I know exactly what it entails and it IS quite simple. I've done it, i've played with it and it's perfect for certain places that you WANT to be maze-like and confusing. I wouldn't do such a thing for every area because it make slittle sense. But a place like the underdark, where a select few races thrive outsiders such as humans and surface elves would find the place very confusing and it would be perfect for such an area. It would also do well in an area that was a classic maze dungeon puzzle.


~S

Yes, have to agree...
This is the kind of thing that does nothing to increase the fun, quite the opposite and though it wouldn't make me leave it would not make me happy either.
Don't. I have better things to do than scribble maps on pieces of paper while the rest of the group stand there waiting...

One or two special areas, maybe...
Not as a general rule.
If you disagree please tell me how on earth something like this could be fun for anyone.


Edit: And the answer came before the question....
That way I like it too.

Gairus wrote:But umm... why?

The reasons are quite obvious.

That wouldn't be fun. I am CERTAIN it would be PW-leaving not-fun for many, too.

I seriously doubt that, especially if done right and not overused. We ARE a roleplay server, not a care bear world. Unlike you i have greater faith in the quality of our players and their ability to immerse themselves in such a situation and have fun RP-ing their way through a confusing and foreign place. Personally i would LOVE to DM an adventure that involved PC's trying to find their way out of the underdark, but only if the minimap was gone/blacked out. Otherwise it is not much of a challenge. If they want to map an area there is always the old fashioned way...



~S

Is that the only way or has someone come up with a genious solution? Is there a way other than screenshots, to transpose information from the automapper window to a printable source or something?

I've been slowly mapping out Avlis using the wonderful Campaign Cartograrpher tool (http://www.profantasy.com/).

My method: after I fully explore a map, I maximize the map tool in NWN, do an ALT-PRINTSCREEN to grab my screen shot, go over to MS Paint, trim out the map, and print it on my color printer.

I then jot down notes on the page (area transitions, regeant locations, monster spawn spots), and open up CC. Then I redraw the map using CC, and I've got a professional looking map.

Its taking a long time, yes

sozin wrote:

Is that the only way or has someone come up with a genious solution? Is there a way other than screenshots, to transpose information from the automapper window to a printable source or something?

I've been slowly mapping out Avlis using the wonderful Campaign Cartograrpher tool (http://www.profantasy.com/).

My method: after I fully explore a map, I maximize the map tool in NWN, do an ALT-PRINTSCREEN to grab my screen shot, go over to MS Paint, trim out the map, and print it on my color printer.

I then jot down notes on the page (area transitions, regeant locations, monster spawn spots), and open up CC. Then I redraw the map using CC, and I've got a professional looking map.

Its taking a long time, yes

And i thoght i had a lot of work with my map of the underdark...

funny thing is after you make the effort to map something you will never forget the areas again.

Maps are for pansies: Either get lost, or hire a guide

Personally, in RL, I don't use maps much - dead reckoning mainly does it for me. Well, dead reckoning plus asking for directions.

I do find the auto-map useful for general orientation though, e.g. have I been here before? which direction am I pointing? etc. The tile-based graphics is just too poor to get this sort of connection with the terrain without a map IMHO.

I personally would like it if there would be no maps at all. Specially when I can run all over Deglos without it. It would be great if you actually would have to get to know the area to move there, rather than just map it once and take screenshots.... that's so OOC...