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Should cookies count toward weekly XP cap?

General discussion about Avlis

Moderators: Nighthawk4, Dungeon Masters

Should cookies count toward your weekly XP cap?

Yes, they're delicious but should count
20
35%
No, keep your hands off my cookies
37
65%
 
Total votes : 57

Re: Should cookies count toward weekly XP cap?

PostAuthor: Tel » Tue Sep 05, 2017 3:19 am

tldr; don't change anything


rambling...
I don't tend to hit my XP cap. If I go off world and get XP I don't tend to hit the XP cap related to that either. I hardly ever remember to do weekly turn in type things (*shakes fist at tokens*) on time. I don't get to attend as many events as I'd like so I don't see that many XP cookies.

Cookies are given for all kinds of reasons, and I think making them a part of a character cap is a side-long way of just trying to monitor them. If the staff as a team feel they're well versed in the how, why and how-much of things they're giving out, then the individual DM should be able to use those guidelines to provide whatever they feel merits the situation. If for some reason the team does NOT think that those guidelines are sufficient, then I would rather see a secondary "token XP drip" system where DM-cookies get banked, and are dripped out to PCs from the bank (until it's dry) like vault XP. That way you can still earn however much you're considered fair to earn, but you just receive it at a slower rate.
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Re: Should cookies count toward weekly XP cap?

PostAuthor: Elradra » Tue Sep 05, 2017 5:25 am

I think I play fairly often. I go on at least one dungeon crawl when I log in, make it to a DM event once or twice a week, and of course enjoy cookies just hanging around chatting in town. It still takes an average of a year or two for me to get a character up to level 40 when I focus on them. With all of the scaling spawns Avlis has I don't notice the game get any more different either. My rogues still need to be cautious and creative with their approaches to conflict, my mages still need to collect and study spells (and sometimes the game code behind them,) my fighters still need to either hunt for or craft better gear to stay relevant, and not a one of my characters will ever be anything in the world without investing the proper RP.

As was stated somewhere else on the forums, there is a clear difference between a level 40 PC and an epic one. Without the time and effort put into a character they will continue to be nothing but a level 1 with extra tricks up their sleeves, no matter what their character sheet says. If the intent of a cookie is as an unobtrusive ping to let people know a DM is on, a similar result could certainly be achieved with a 25xp cookie rather than a few hundred. But I say the Evard's spell and a reliance on 9,000 buffing spells are far greater impediments to complete, fulfilling character growth than excessive xp gifts.
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Re: Should cookies count toward weekly XP cap?

PostAuthor: Xeo » Tue Sep 05, 2017 6:51 am

Interesting percentage swing here. So there more No's, than Yes's and there is a good sized percentage of the community that don't agree with that DM cookies being part of the XP cap.
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Re: Should cookies count toward weekly XP cap?

PostAuthor: surfer69 » Tue Sep 05, 2017 7:52 am

Yes, Xeo, that's pretty obviously what the poll shows, and that's why I made it - to find out.

Thanks for deleting that comment, LadyAwesome. I'm curious, though, to hear anything you'd like to say on the topic. Your input, especially as a member of the Team, would be valuable to me.
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Re: Should cookies count toward weekly XP cap?

PostAuthor: Pekarion » Tue Sep 05, 2017 8:33 am

What would be kind of interesting is if cookies counted towards the cap at a regular rate, while party XP was half. That would make party XP better than Event XP. I wonder if that would make much of a difference in playing style for those who DO reach their cap every week.
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Re: Should cookies count toward weekly XP cap?

PostAuthor: Xeo » Tue Sep 05, 2017 8:40 am

surfer69 wrote:Yes, Xeo, that's pretty obviously what the poll shows, and that's why I made it - to find out.


I was bringing a piece of information to light and a progress check on the development of the poll.

That's why I pointed it out.
Silk wrote:I don't know, I think flinging poo in a catapult could be pretty damn effective.
I know if I was on the battlefield and I got hit by a pile of shit... I'd probably go home.
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Re: Should cookies count toward weekly XP cap?

PostAuthor: LadyAwesome » Tue Sep 05, 2017 8:49 am

To me, RP xp is worth more then grinding.
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Re: Should cookies count toward weekly XP cap?

PostAuthor: Ninjar » Tue Sep 05, 2017 9:08 am

Wow, this one got spicy quickly.

My opinion: I'm for-gainst it.

Personally, I think the last time I hit my cap was when I was exploring Deglos with Rollek, and that is just because I had to fight my way out of all manner of shaahesk, troll, troglodytes, crabs, dragons, umber hulks, etc. Regarding DM cookies, I personally enjoy the periodic cookie during an event and then the 'dessert cookie' at the end. On top of that, the 'awesome quip/rp' cookies that you get in when you nail a line or do something really cool IC.

Would I have an issue with cookies counting 1/2 or 1/4 toward cap lin some way similar to party xp? Not at all! However, I don't really know the work involved and I don't really know the degree to which they effect level progression. Tangentially, and something I feel more capable of speaking on, I wouldn't mind the Vault XP being dialed down a little (no one bite this worm! Cookies is the word).

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LadyAwesome wrote:RP xp is worth more then grinding.


Regarding this, I don't see visiting a dungeon with a party as grinding. The game is based on Dungeons & Dragons after all! If you're all RPing and chatting IC there's not a huge disconnect save that no DM is typically around while you're doing it.
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Re: Should cookies count toward weekly XP cap?

PostAuthor: surfer69 » Tue Sep 05, 2017 11:01 am

Being the original poster, and after getting some really unpleasant blowback in Tells while trying to play tonight, I just wanted to say this:

Even though it's a "yes" and "no" vote (because that's how polls work), there's no "winner" and "loser" in terms of the discrepancy of "yes" versus "no" votes. It was always just a discussion to see how people feel and why, and the comments matter a lot more than the votes. It's just like NWN and Dungeons & Dragons should be: no winners and no losers. But I think some folks don't see that in either instance.

And I'm guessing that given the number of unique posters of comments versus the number of votes cast, a lot of people (e.g., tl;dr) didn't read my original post, the discussion, or anything else and just voted "no". That's fine, because that's your right, but it doesn't help advance the conversation at all.

And why do all of these things have to turn nasty or make people think it's about them? It makes me sad to think this is where we are as a team and playerbase if I can't start a talk like this without being accused of "trolling."
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Re: Should cookies count toward weekly XP cap?

PostAuthor: Micah » Tue Sep 05, 2017 11:27 am

I could have used an option 3, Relationship Status: It's Complicated.

I definitely wanted to read this as a survey and discussion. Polls are not democratic votes.

It may be time for a primer on how to debate things on forums. *goes rummaging*
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Re: Should cookies count toward weekly XP cap?

PostAuthor: surfer69 » Tue Sep 05, 2017 11:41 am

Micah wrote:I could have used an option 3, Relationship Status: It's Complicated.


Good point. In retrospect, I really wish I had done that.
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Re: Should cookies count toward weekly XP cap?

PostAuthor: Xeo » Tue Sep 05, 2017 12:04 pm

surfer69 wrote:Being the original poster, and after getting some really unpleasant blowback in Tells while trying to play tonight, I just wanted to say this:

Even though it's a "yes" and "no" vote (because that's how polls work), there's no "winner" and "loser" in terms of the discrepancy of "yes" versus "no" votes. It was always just a discussion to see how people feel and why, and the comments matter a lot more than the votes. It's just like NWN and Dungeons & Dragons should be: no winners and no losers. But I think some folks don't see that in either instance.

And I'm guessing that given the number of unique posters of comments versus the number of votes cast, a lot of people (e.g., tl;dr) didn't read my original post, the discussion, or anything else and just voted "no". That's fine, because that's your right, but it doesn't help advance the conversation at all.

And why do all of these things have to turn nasty or make people think it's about them? It makes me sad to think this is where we are as a team and playerbase if I can't start a talk like this without being accused of "trolling."


I was reacting wrongly to my interpretation of a select few changing forum avatars, which clearly looked to me, a mockery of your original thread discussion.

You have my public apology here and I never intended to derail or devalue your discussion topic surfer.
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Re: Should cookies count toward weekly XP cap?

PostAuthor: Orleron » Tue Sep 05, 2017 7:19 pm

Friends, take a step back for a minute, slow our roll, and check out what I think the underlying message is here:

See my other thread:
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Re: Should cookies count toward weekly XP cap?

PostAuthor: bolo » Tue Sep 05, 2017 8:13 pm

I've hit cap elatively often, but that's because whenever I play, I roll up new characters.nighthawk aint the only one with a bigass player vault. You shouldda seen my old, lost in the mists of time, one. Fairly easy to hit cap in the first couple levels.As someone who's essentially a perpetual newbie, the only reason I give a shit about XP is that everybody has at least 20 levels ( that's probably a conservative estimate) on any characters I could come up with. I don't consider any of my old characters really playable nowadays. they were either boosted in level because of the XP code that I don't even know how to play these strangers ( if that makes any sense), or they outlived their shelf life rp wise. It's too bad there's no way to opt out of gaining xp, or stop it. Some characters are more fun to play as lowbies ( seriously, I'm not crazy or drunk!). but I guess that's a completely, totally, different topic.. Anyway, I voted nein! Nein I say!
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Re: Should cookies count toward weekly XP cap?

PostAuthor: Jazz » Tue Sep 05, 2017 8:16 pm

Bolo, you can always ask a DM to take away XP (if you are to find one IG, you can always try IRC).
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Re: Should cookies count toward weekly XP cap?

PostAuthor: bolo » Wed Sep 06, 2017 3:02 am

Jazz wrote:Bolo, you can always ask a DM to take away XP (if you are to find one IG, you can always try IRC).


Well that's pretty awesome. Will have to remember that going forward. Am assuming removing levels/XP from a character that's several years old wouldn't be possible ( I already rolled up another lowbie anyway)..
Sorry guys. We now return you to the poll!
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Re: Should cookies count toward weekly XP cap?

PostAuthor: Sarmanos » Wed Sep 06, 2017 4:18 am

bolo wrote:
Jazz wrote:Bolo, you can always ask a DM to take away XP (if you are to find one IG, you can always try IRC).


Well that's pretty awesome. Will have to remember that going forward. Am assuming removing levels/XP from a character that's several years old wouldn't be possible ( I already rolled up another lowbie anyway)..
Sorry guys. We now return you to the poll!


I don't think it is as easy as that since that would veer into Refreshing territory which has its own set of rules, but if you have a PC that qualifies, they'll help.
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Re: Should cookies count toward weekly XP cap?

PostAuthor: l1t3r » Wed Sep 06, 2017 5:28 am

I think the team has always said they would take away xp/levels gained by the idle xp given when you log in. That being said, if you've been playing the character, than yes, Sarm is right. You could, as well, always ask to say....take away the 15k in xp you earned during the DM event you were just on. There shouldn't be an issue with that.
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