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Re: NWN Enhanced Edition Notes and Discussion

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 6:23 pm
Author: Gorgon
PlasmaJohn wrote:I also asked what happens during a MS outage. In Classic NWN there's a server flag to ignore it. Would not surprise me in the least if they left that one out.

Either way, if they won't commit to letting PW's manage their own authentication then I very strong advise against using NWN:EE for PW purposes.

Just did a quick test of the 2 flags for this, with no internet connection at all, while using the EE Linux server in a VM with EE connecting.

Code: Select all
Master Server Authentication Required For Player Login=1

This refuses player connections to the server, and allows them when set to 0

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Account validation required during Master Server down times=1

This shuts down the server's online connections.

When both are set to 0, I can connect. This is with an empty new test module. Forget using an Avlis module with no NWNX. It blows up real fast.

This doesn't mean much at this time, since they are planning all sorts of changes, and the Linux server is still an infant. They may decide not to allow them in the future, but having them allowed ~may~ mean we can continue to use the current alpha. I wouldn't be surprised if we lost our listing on the game client browser though, which would be bad (I couldn't see my own local VM with them switched, but this wasn't exactly a proper test). I also wouldn't be surprised if Beamdog's legal dept. clamped down hard on anyone posting ways of replacing their game server listing too, like we have with NWNCX and the current game.


People are trying all sorts of things with the early stuff, including tweaking the net code to allow access for EE clients to old servers (PJ mentioned that in his post), but that could stop working at any time with their updates. The reverse (old clients playing on updated EE servers) is unlikely, but I never say anything is impossible with this community. It is all wishing and dreaming ATM though, so don't assume anything that works now will continue working (not when lawyers and the almighty $dollar are back in the picture). :(

Until we get their totally redone NWNX source to update for Avlis, see what else they change before release, and get it all into some kind of test environment (which all needs people doing the work), I wouldn't assume anything. It's easy say we can do stuff, from a bunch of forum posts that other people made using their own servers, when they don't know what Avlis uses. I'd listen to PJ on that topic, since NWNX came from Avlis (far smarter people than me), and he's written/created or been involved with most, if not all, aspects of the very custom setup we have here. :mrgreen:

People here are very aware of EE, and are looking at everything, so have some faith in the team (or apply to help even :wink: ).

Re: NWN Enhanced Edition Notes and Discussion

PostPosted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 6:08 am
Author: Sarmanos
PlasmaJohn wrote:
Sarmanos wrote:Some of the PW admins have been making unreasonable demands and even threats to protect their turf as far as player retention goes.

Did you actually read the concerns or did you dismiss them as poors? There are valid concerns beyond not willing to part with $20.

Since the kerfuffle I'm adding poor developer attitude as a big one. It could be a case of cranky software hack. We'll see if what was said gets walked back or not. If not I'd be very wary of trusting that outfit.

I'm gonna go out on a limb and venture that the claims of a substantial amount of remaining NWN persistent world players still being on Vista or even XP is being exaggerated greatly by those over there making said claim. I really doubt that all 7% of the remaining users with PCs online are still bothering with XP are playing NWN.

From what I've gathered of the doomsaying here and there I would be led to believe:

1) Current players won't buy it and pay $20 because the game is old and looks bad.
2) New people won't buy it and pay $20 because the game is old and looks bad.
3) Lapsed players that used to own it but stopped playing for whatever reason won't buy it and pay $20 because the game is old and looks bad.
4) No one will move forth because a lot of remaining players are apparently running on obsolete software and hardware that they can't afford to or otherwise won't upgrade.

I can tell you right now reasons 1-3 aren't true at all because games that arguably look worse than NWN get re-released and people buy them instantly with the promise that it has gotten some updates so that it works just as good if not better with whatever modern hardware or console they run it on, and this is with no real new additions to the game except HD graphics or higher res and widescreen if that. As for number four, unless I see some credible data, I'm gonna assume the number of people actively playing on PWs on an unsupported OS is maybe 50 tops and I am being extremely overly generous with that. The Windows XP usage market share is barely 7% now and Vista can't even manage a whole number.

I am willing to hear out any number of technical reasons that make moving forth prohibitive and risky, especially with the master server. The four reasons above though are just excuses to stubbornly hold out or otherwise attempt to rationalize not moving on for whatever internal real reason it is. I am truly sorry if anyone does genuinely get left behind because they just can't afford to get some more current hardware and software, but holding everything back just to retain an extreme extreme minority isn't fair to those who want a stable and relatively bug free NWN that isn't slowly falling apart on modern systems. It is also showing a mindset that there's a belief that there will be zero player gain and growth in NWN EE and that's it is better to hold out and stubbornly try to maintain what you have.

Re: NWN Enhanced Edition Notes and Discussion

PostPosted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 6:35 am
Author: Gorgon
Wasn't the last post you made here (that you deleted) saying people are too fixated on that $20, after still miss-reading PJ's:
There are valid concerns beyond not willing to part with $20.

How about letting things sort themselves out for a little while, and at least see what is doable, before stirring up more torches and pitch forks. :)