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Discussion of Avlis policy on: Faking IC races/abilities aka

Rules and Guidelines

Moderator: Dungeon Masters

PostAuthor: Sindol » Tue Jun 03, 2003 4:26 pm

Zelphi wrote:Detect thoughts is a level 2 arcane spell that lets you read surface thoughts and there are cantrips that let you do minor displays. A level 20 divination wizard might be able to learn something about a person though, and certainly legend lore would.


It's really very simple:

1. NWN is based on 3rd edition DND, but is not the same, so no use making these unreachable parallels.

2. Spells that are not in NWN can thus not be cast, abilities not implemented in NWN can not be used at abilities. Seems logical to me, but then again, I have been accused of being too logical at times. *checks ears* No still not pointy.
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PostAuthor: Ashlynn » Tue Jun 03, 2003 4:31 pm

Zelphi wrote:Detect thoughts is a level 2 arcane spell that lets you read surface thoughts


Detect thoughts would be very hard to implement. You're basically relying on the other player to be honest and send you a tell describing his surface thoughts accurately.

To me, being able to read someone's mind ruins a lot of the fun of the game. It can be a plot-killer. Plus, then the team has to implement a lot of anti-scrying and anti-divination items because there's no way in all the nine hells that some characters are going to risk having someone read their thoughts.

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PostAuthor: KinX » Tue Jun 03, 2003 4:51 pm

Ashlynn wrote:To me, being able to read someone's mind ruins a lot of the fun of the game. It can be a plot-killer. Plus, then the team has to implement a lot of anti-scrying and anti-divination items because there's no way in all the nine hells that some characters are going to risk having someone read their thoughts.


i know this is pointless, but i feel that i should say it...

spellcraft skill should tell someone what the spell being cast was, then the following situation could occur:

Kharak: OY! oi know what ye just cast on me, bastard. Ye might've been able t' see th' last thing goin' through me head. But oi cen tell ye th' last thing goin' through yer damned head withoot a blasted spell!
Spellcaster: (smug) Yeah? why don't you tell me what's going through my head then?
Kharak: ME AXE!!! GRRAAHHH!!!

hehe...sorry...i failed my Will save...couldn't resist
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PostAuthor: Ashlynn » Tue Jun 03, 2003 4:56 pm

KinX wrote:i know this is pointless, but i feel that i should say it...

spellcraft skill should tell someone what the spell being cast was, then the following situation could occur:

Kharak: OY! oi know what ye just cast on me, bastard. Ye might've been able t' see th' last thing goin' through me head. But oi cen tell ye th' last thing goin' through yer damned head withoot a blasted spell!
Spellcaster: (smug) Yeah? why don't you tell me what's going through my head then?
Kharak: ME AXE!!! GRRAAHHH!!!


Heh. Oh dear gods, I can't believe the Hammer and I were sharing a thought. I was entertaining images of Kima attacking every single mage who started wigglin' their fingers in the middle of a conversation.

*evil grin*

Or just standing there and thinking nasty thoughts to watch his reaction.

"Mmmmm, he looks tasty in his robe and wizard hat...."

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PostAuthor: KinX » Tue Jun 03, 2003 4:59 pm

Ashlynn wrote:"Mmmmm, he looks tasty in his robe and wizard hat...."


you have to be careful with thoughts like that, some wizards might like you eating them....*cough*

*puts on robe and wizard hat*
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PostAuthor: FunkOdyssey » Tue Jun 03, 2003 5:16 pm

*Aramil puts on his robe and his Don Juan Wizard Hat*

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PostAuthor: WrathOG777 » Tue Jun 03, 2003 5:29 pm

*Wizard casts detect thoughts*
Wizard tells you,"What are you thinking?"
Baal, "spell fails"
Wizard tells you,"I just casted detect thoughts! You have to tell me your thoughts!"
Baal, "I told you your spell failed."
*Wizard casts detect thoughts*
Wizard tells you,"Ok, what are you thinking now?"
Baal, "spell fails again."
Wizard tells you,"GAH! Power gamer!"
Baal, "Maybe you could try someone that is not ODed on mellowsmoke and gobln's brew..."
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PostAuthor: Orleron » Wed Jun 04, 2003 2:40 am

JollyOrc gets it pretty well. That's the basic spirit of what we are trying to say.

It may very well be one day that Bioware will enable psionics, or someone will hak psionics into the game in an acceptable manner and we'll have it as a character class. But until then, it's cheesing because it's something that is meant to affect the other character but does not show up in the engine.
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PostAuthor: Alexandru Stanicu » Mon Oct 13, 2003 4:03 am

Creating a halfling and pertending to be a human child, or "underdeveloped" human adult is a case of first class cheesing.

It has been done in the past, but is not going to be allowed in the future.
We have 2 players that are "grandfathered" in on this and any others will be required to remake their characters.

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PostAuthor: Olaf » Mon Oct 13, 2003 4:18 am

Alexandru Stanicu wrote:Creating a halfling and pertending to be a human child, or "underdeveloped" human adult is a case of first class chesseing.

It has been done in the past, but is not going to be allowed in the future.
We have 2 players that are "grandfathered" in on this and any others will be required to remake their characters.

-Alex

What about npcs??? I was going to use a halfling body for One of my characters kids.. is that considered cheesing too??.. Maybe i am missing the point but no need to explain it to me.. All i want to know is If i can make a halfling for One of my characters to be her kid... i should also tell you that i was going to script the kid to follow her on a command word..so others would see this as well...
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PostAuthor: Orleron » Mon Oct 13, 2003 1:37 pm

For NPC's it's no problem, because you can just give it a halfling body and change its race to Human.

For PC's it's a problem because the game thinks it's a halfling and gives it all the usual halfling racial adjustments, yet the PC says it's a human.
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PostAuthor: Furin » Mon Oct 13, 2003 4:38 pm

It's also always an option (for NPCs) to simply use the human children models, right?

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PostAuthor: Vanor » Mon Oct 13, 2003 6:01 pm

Furin wrote:It's also always an option (for NPCs) to simply use the human children models, right?


Sure, that's what you should do really.
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PostAuthor: Garand » Thu Feb 26, 2004 2:11 am

Alexandru Stanicu wrote:Creating a halfling and pertending to be a human child, or "underdeveloped" human adult is a case of first class cheesing.

It has been done in the past, but is not going to be allowed in the future.
We have 2 players that are "grandfathered" in on this and any others will be required to remake their characters.

-Alex


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PostAuthor: Guest » Wed Jun 02, 2004 11:35 pm

What about playing a Kender which is a race of halfling just not in forgotten realms which of course as we know in D&D anything is possible for them to get there from a magic item to spelljammer ship?

They are basicly halfling and have similar abilities to a halfling in Forgotten realms and they are very fun to rp.

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PostAuthor: Fire Monkey » Wed Jun 02, 2004 11:59 pm

I think the general rule if you want to play a non-avlis race that comes from another plane/planet is that you should make that character elsewhere (i.e. on another CoPaP world) and if you wish, bring it to Avlis. If you cannot find another world where you can make the race you desire then basically it is not available and there is no way it could exist within the CoPaP system of worlds. Therefore, in line with this thread, to play such a race would be deemed to be cheesing.

Not sure if it is what your suggesting or not but Avlis is not a FR world so whether they exist there or not is irrelevant.
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PostAuthor: Titanium Dragon » Thu Jun 03, 2004 2:47 am

Kender are Dragonlance, and AFAIK there are no Dragonlance servers within CoPaP at this time.
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PostAuthor: Guest » Thu Jun 03, 2004 5:40 pm

I would like to make a character with sever night blindness, like to the point of not being able to see a few centimeters infront of their face. In all other ways the character is a normal human. That wouldn't be cheesing would it?

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PostAuthor: Orleron » Thu Jun 03, 2004 5:47 pm

A disability that does not affect your appearance, such as blindness or deafness, would probably be ok, except that you might possibly get yourself into trouble with other players doing that on Avlis. By this, I mean that if you roleplay a blind person, you're setting yourself up to be accused by other players of metagaming if you happen to do something that only a sighted person could possibly do. I do know that there are a couple of characters that are mute, and they seem to work well though.
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PostAuthor: Vanor » Thu Jun 03, 2004 5:50 pm

Anonymous wrote:That wouldn't be cheesing would it?


No, cheesing is normally making your character better then normal, or forcing other people to RP around him a given way. Doing what you want is fine. :)
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PostAuthor: Guest » Thu Jun 03, 2004 5:56 pm

"By this, I mean that if you roleplay a blind person, you're setting yourself up to be accused by other players of metagaming if you happen to do something that only a sighted person could possibly do."

Good point. I'll have to be extra careful, thank you.

And thank you for the rapid replies.

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PostAuthor: Liartes » Thu Jun 03, 2004 7:52 pm

Anonymous wrote:I would like to make a character with sever night blindness, like to the point of not being able to see a few centimeters infront of their face. In all other ways the character is a normal human. That wouldn't be cheesing would it?


Heh, ol' Scurby the Dwarf starts screaming and crying whenever night hits. He can't do anything without a torch. Usually has to be forced into his hands, as he can't do anything for himself when that happens.

Not quite blindness (I don't think) but definitely funny. So yes, it can be done. :D
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PostAuthor: Wyrmwing » Fri Jun 04, 2004 12:20 am

Orleron wrote:I do know that there are a couple of characters that are mute, and they seem to work well though.


Being mute can be handled pretty well as long as you only emote (*smiles*, *nods*, etc) and/or have a method of writing down what the character wants to say. One does not really have any need for speech then.
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PostAuthor: Halrawk » Fri Jul 02, 2004 6:23 am

Well, I haven't joined yet (and I don't know if my application will be accepted, sorry for sending 2 BTW, my internet screwed up.) but I was wondering if playing as a sub-class of Elf that is not in Avlis would be considered cheesing? I wanted my character to be a wood elf.

The background story I currently have for my character would work with him as either an elf or a wood elf, but wood elf would make more sense.

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PostAuthor: Tangleroot » Fri Jul 02, 2004 6:50 am

ONLY real races are allowed. Custom races are goblin, kobold, half-ogre, half-nymph, half-dryad, drangonari elf, lizardman, and orc. You CANNOT play any other races other than these and the standard elf, dwarf, human, halfling, etc.


That falls under this, so it's cheesing.
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